He is an extrovert and she is an introvert. He likes beaches and she likes mountains. She explodes under stress, he is more composed. Theirs is an inter-caste marriage—he is a Maharashtrian Hindu and she is Catholic. But among all these divergences there is a one big common point and that is their skill of managing people, an ability also acquired by their son— they are HR professionals. Shrikant Dikhale, Vice President – Corporate Affairs, CSR and Administration, Kansai Nerolac Paints Ltd, and his wife Karen Dikhale, an HR professional and former Organisation Development (OD) Executive, HR, Marico Ltd, say that one thing that has helped their marriage to be a success is both being in an HR profession—it has helped them get the best out of each other, have respect for each other’s job and understand each other better. In a candid talk with Corporate Citizen, Karen and Shrikant speak forthrightly about how dealing with people comes easier to them and much more about their life and career
Shrikant: My native place is Jejuri, in Pune district, a place from where my grandfather had moved to Pune city. My father, Shridhar Dikhale, was in government service and he moved to Mumbai, in Bandra when he was transferred as a Regional Labour Commissioner, Central Government. I was born in Pune and lived with my parents in Bandra. Since then till now I have been staying in Bandra.
I had two role models in my life—first one was my father, he has always been my role model. Besides being an honest and upright officer, his greatest quality was his humility. As a kid I watched his ability to interact with people at all levels and observed that he was respected and revered in our community. My mother, Vatsala, was probably the best finance minister ever and kept us so happy with limited resources. She is 84 years but has an amazing memory and till today can solve mathematical problems be it Algebra or Geometry. Despite her simple background, she speaks flawless English, is well updated on all current matters and is a big cricket fan. My elder sister worked in a bank and my younger brother is a civil engineer and working with a construction company. My younger sister is working with Life Insurance Corporation (LIC), as Director-Marketing.
At a later stage in life I had one more role model, Ratnakar Gaikwad, my cousin who grew up in a very simple family and became an honest bureaucrat rising up to the highest level. He retired as the Chief Secretary, Maharashtra State Government and now is the RTI Commissioner of Maharashtra state. He is known to be a most honest, hard-working and dedicated bureaucrat and with a flawless career as an IAS officer. On a personal level he is amazing—despite the huge responsibilities, he always has time for the family. He is a classic example to youngsters, that even in today’s times one can succeed by sheer dedication, honesty and determination.
Karen: I am born and brought up in Bandra. My dad was a businessman and my mom a homemaker. Mom was a teacher with Don Bosco School, but left working when she got married. I am the eldest of the siblings, along with a young brother and a sister. My brother took over the family business and my sister is right now living in Mexico, married to a German.
I graduated in Sociology Major from Sophia College, Mumbai, in 1980. While in college, my career goal was to get into the travel industry, possibly as an air hostess. After graduation, I did one year travel and tourism diploma course from Sophia Polytechnic. I was 21 when I took my first job at a travel agency, where I worked for around one and half year. It was a trial- by-fire experience, because after a week on the job, I was put in charge of the domestic flights counter, a very high pressure work. It was absolutely crazy, worked for one and a half year and realised this is not what I want to do in my life.
Then I left travel agency and did a secretarial course, thinking of getting into something very peaceful. This was the time when we got married. In a month’s time after marriage I joined an indenting house where I worked for over three years. I left that and joined Marico Ltd, solely because, Marico office was moving to Bandra and it was a five-days-a-week work. It was the time our son, Siddharth was born.
“Youngsters today are very ambitious and they are willing to work hard. Today, if you don’t work hard, you will not last in the job. Within that how much better you can do compared to the others will be the differentiator”
- Shrikant Dikhale
Karen: I met Shrikant while I was working at the travel agency and he was in Siemens—he has been chasing me since I was sixteen. He happened to be the friend of my college friend’s elder brother. We were going around for three years and later got married—I was 23 years old then. My parents initially were not very happy—ours was the first inter-caste marriage in my family and in his family also. Both our parents took a little time but they got over it and became supportive. Basically when we were going around, I was very clear that it was for keeps and obviously he was also quite sure about that and we kind of assumed that we were going to get married very soon. So, there was no bending on your knees, no romantic proposal. Our only worry was how our parents would take it.
"Times change, culture changes, people change—I frankly don’t find anything wrong with someone wanting to move on and look for better opportunities"
- Karen Dikhale
Karen: I joined Marico, as a secretary in HR department. After a period of five years, I left the secretarial line and moved to HR. A secretary in HR department at Marico, was not just a secretary taking dictation, drafting letters, taking boss appointments—we had to also deal with letters of appointment and keeping the database of employees. Secretary was my starting role and then my boss felt that I could do more and I got to move out of the secretarial role. I was given the role of Organisation Development (OD) Executive—I worked as OD for 24 years. I left Marico in 2015.
Karen: For a woman, dealing with people comes easier and that is the reason why I think a lot of women get into the HR field. When I joined HR in Marico, I had no formal training in HR management. It was all life experience and that has helped me along. In my role as OD executive, I worked very closely with chief human resources officer, dealt with the top management, dealt with interviews, appointments, on-boarding processes, increments, resignations, exits etc.
Karen: We lived in a joint family for thirteen years after marriage, before we moved to another house. I had no worries for Siddharth, as my mother- in-law and my sister-in-law were there to take care of him in my absence. When you have a joint family support, it becomes much easier. When you don’t have that it can become a serious problem. Because of joint family support, I would say I could work. Otherwise, a working mother goes through a tremendous guilt—first you are leaving your child when he/ she is so small and you hear such horror stories of ill-treatment of children from caretakers. I would have had to quit without a joint family support, because I would have never left my son at a day care. I agree that working mothers do miss a lot of their children’s childhood days, but then you have to decide what you want, whether you want to spend time with your child or you want to work and earn to give them a better life. This dilemma is there.
Shrikant: I have been very lucky to have very good bosses. One important lesson I learnt is that everything has a shelf-life and another lesson is respect everyone—it is what I learnt over the years working with great bosses. They would respect me as a young junior and that has taught me to respect everyone. I have to be able to work with anyone and nothing is right or wrong in this world, it is just your point of view. I have had lot of skirmishes in the young days with the unions. As I grew, I realised that they also have their different point of view. Management cannot be only one-sided thinking. I think if you respect people, respect their point of view, you can still have your point-of-view. One important aspect, have a sense of humour, makes life so much more fun.
Karen: In a nutshell, we all have the power to make our wishes come true as long as we keep on believing, that has been my philosophy throughout, in my life and work.
Karen: Times change, cultures change, people change—I frankly don’t find anything wrong with someone wanting to move on and look for better opportunities. If one feels that they are stagnating in the company, company is not able to give what they want and they are able to find what they want in other company, then why not. But, job hopping for the sake of increasing compensation benefits, is not right. That I think is a bad career move. In HR you cannot become an entrepreneur or make a mark on your own initially—you have to spend some time working, gain experience and then go on your own. If you want to start with HR consultancy, it comes much later.
Shrikant: Youngsters today are very ambitious and they are willing to work hard. Today, if you don’t work hard, you will not last in the job. Within that how much better you can do compared to the others will be the differentiator. I think the youngsters today are knowledgeable and I personally have learnt and continue to learn a lot from my past and present young team members.
Shrikant: Being in an HR profession has helped us both, because as an HR you have to deal with different people and you have to get the best out of them. So, both being in HR there is a respect for each other’s job and you can understand each other better. For example, if I were to come late even at this stage, she knows that this is the compensation time, so she knows those 15 days or one month in the year when I am likely to be late or whatever—I don’t have to explain. We are even able to discuss HR issues and she is a big critic of mine.
Karen: He plays a pacifier role. I explode—he keeps quiet and listens, and then I calm down.
Karen: I like his humour and his wit—he is an extrovert. I was a very introvert person, but I have changed over the years and that’s what HR makes you—you interact with people all the time. I became more extrovert working in HR. He is at his best in a crowd, he loves it. In fact all my relatives love it when he is around. They want him to be at the party because he is absolute life of the party. He is a sea person and I am a mountain person.
Shrikant: She is not exactly an introvert, but she takes time. She is very quiet type and very happy. She prefers quieter holidays and quieter evenings. I like the beaches and she likes the hills and the mountains. Karen is very organised and efficient and to top it all, she’s a great cook. So, Siddharth and me have no complaints except having to listen to her all the time, asking us to keep the house neat and clean.
Shrikant: It needs a lot of adjustment. The good part is that understanding is easier when both are working. We are in the same field, but at the same time a lot of adjustment is required. In our particular case, 80 per cent of adjustment was from her side and hardly 20 per cent from my side. I am from a Maharashtrian Hindu joint family and she is from a Catholic family. They would eat with a fork and spoon and we would eat with our hands. For us salad was only sliced unions, tomatoes, cucumber. A lot of credit goes to her and also to my parents—it must have been a big challenge to them, a Catholic girl coming into their house. But in a matter of a year or two, she became more like a daughter to them. Studying in a Catholic school in Bandra, I have been brought up in Bandra. I could slip into her family and Catholic culture without any problem. I felt at ease from day one because I was able to vibe with them. Despite one major handicap that I don’t drink and smoke. I think my schooling in Bandra and having Catholic friends helped me immensely to seamlessly merge into her family. Even today we celebrate all the festivals. We celebrate Sankrant, Holi, Easter, Dassera, Diwali, Christmas, with the same pomp. We have the best of both worlds. I will say mixed marriage has helped and it’s great. In our son’s case, we have left it to him. We have not forced any religious practice or culture on him, it is entirely his call.
Karen: I had no problem adjusting to Shrikant’s family. I never felt like I am a misfit there. I came from a Catholic upbringing, but moving to Shrikant’s family was not a culture shock for me at all. In fact I liked the Mehendi, wearing the traditional outfits and the festivals.
Karen: The day our son was born is the most memorable moment in our life.
Shrikant: When her father agreed for our marriage. I was very scared and we really didn’t know what would happen—it was a big worry for us. Fortunately all ended well and had no problem from either side.
Shrikant: I love driving and playing badminton regularly with my group of friends, which I have been doing for the last 30 years. We try and make one holiday abroad at least every alternate year. If we get few days holiday in a row, we go to Alibaug where we have our own studio apartment. We love Alibaug and it is the most de-stressing place we have experienced. We are foodies and I am strictly non-vegetarian. I have lot of school friends and they are all ‘Bandra boys’, every first Sunday of the month we meet for breakfast at any of the old Irani joints. These are the friends who make my laugh a little louder, my smile a little brighter and my life a lot better. It is often said that “Zind ahenge toh Milenge” but my school friends say, “Milenge toh Zinda rahenge” —an amazing group and an important anchor in my life.
Karen: I am not much of a non-veg person. I love and prefer vegetarian. After I left work at Marico, I had lot of time for myself.
Karen: For success in marriage and relationship, understanding, compromising and adjustment, are very important. I think failure in marriage is happening because the couple is not willing to understand each other, not willing to compromise and not willing to go that extra mile.
Shrikant: You have to keep yourself updated, if youngsters today don’t keep themselves updated, they will have a serious problem. For an old timer like me, I have great respect for technology, but we are using technology far more judiciously. Despite the fast paced technological advances in every sphere of life, we still understand the importance of human values and human touch. I think people of my generation are able to use technology far more effectively and judiciously than the younger generation. Go for a drive, if possible, keep a pet, listen to music, and above all, meet people...life is great!
“Stop getting into the trap of doing voluminous transactional work. While this may give you a false sense of being busy and hardworking, in reality it may not be adding much value to the business. HR will have to focus on strategy and strategy implementation. It will have to ensure that the internal talent is continuously developed to meet the ever changing and volatile business scenario”
I missed doing my MBA, because 40 years ago it was not a very big thing. I got a job and thought why will I need an MBA? However, it was in the second half of my career, when I realised that maybe I should have done something. I did add a few qualifications later on, but I missed this path and that’s why now I don’t miss an opportunity of going to campuses and meeting students. When I come to campuses, I feel like I have come to learn.
I am a commerce graduate in costing, accounting and internal audit, from Sydenham College in Mumbai. I started my career in 1978, I was just 20 years old—there was an ad in a newspaper for Commercial Trainees required in Siemens and I had applied. I was in Pune on a holiday, when I received a call letter for an interview. I left Pune urgently for the interview and to my delight I got selected. I hadn’t even informed my parents that I had applied.
I got a job opportunity in a big company like Siemens, so I just grabbed it. I joined the company as a junior accounts officer. After about eight years in Accounts I was given an assignment in Internal Audit. This was an absolute turn around for me both personally and professionally. The role of an Auditor brought upon me the realisation that in order for me to raise questions, I had to first be a role model. Being nearly 10 years in the internal audit of all the things, it turned around my life. I was very young, didn’t bother about promotion and didn’t care for anything more. Being an Internal Auditor brought a huge realisation for me—an Internal Auditor has the right and the authority to question practically any department and, it dawned on me that in order to question any employee or a system or process, I would need to be above board in my conduct. I realised that I would have to be a role model to earn the respect of those I was going to audit. This brought about dramatic change in the manner I conducted myself, the way I dressed, the way I communicated, being punctual at meetings and generally gave me the feeling that I was part of the ‘management’. After a three year successful stint in internal audit, I was offered an HR officer’s role in the factory. Honestly, I had no inkling about HR but Guru and also my first boss, Giri Dore, said that HR is all about dealing with people and knowing you, this will be a cakewalk for you. And then began my amazing journey in HR which still continues.
To be wise you have to be old, but before that you have to be young and stupid, only then you can be old and wise. But the problem says Shrikant Dikhale, Vice President – Corporate Affairs, CSR and Administration, Kansai Nerolac Paints Ltd, is that we get old too fast and wise too late. He started his career in Accounts and Costing and after a stint in Internal Audit, took on a Team Leader role in Plant HR, an area which was totally alien to him. With over 30 years of experience in the HR profession of which 12 years was as Head of HR at Kansai Nerolac Paints, Dikhale, speaks to Corporate Citizen on how HR practice has undergone a huge change over the years, how it is getting democratised, the future of HR role and last but not the least, what can we do to be young and wise in our career path
It was 1990 when I stepped into factory HR. That time it was Personnel Department and not HR, the way it is talked about today. Personnel was lot to do with Time and Attendance, Payroll, Statutory compliances, and of course regular skirmishes with the unions. I had a fairly large team reporting to me, including some much senior to me in age, and who were experts in their domain. A daunting task indeed, but I soon earned their respect by simply being a team member who did not try to show superiority and by being less of a ‘boss’ in the traditional sense. I soon began to realise that running a factory was not just about producing goods or making some products, there was a lot of human element which has to be handled sensitively and it was here that I learnt about the ‘Labour’ aspect of Material, Labour and Overheads, figures which I frequently churned out in accounts.
Till today, I firmly believe and am fully convinced that those HR professionals aspiring to be HR Heads, must necessarily spend not less than 2-3 years in the plant and that too in the early part of their career. It is only when you work in a plant environment that you realise that there is nothing right or wrong...there is just another viewpoint which may be different from yours. Learn to understand and respect it because the circumstances and situations are vastly different on the shop floor especially when compared to the corporate office. I did have a very good equation with the union representatives and while we had our differences, we did have mutual respect.
During my five year tenure at the plant, I decided to pursue some HR related courses. I completed a part-time diploma in Personnel Management and Industrial Relations and also did three years Law at the G J Advani Law College in Bandra, close to where I live. I thoroughly enjoyed studying Law and this was probably because in my young days I loved reading Perry Mason books by Erle Stanley Gardner.
HR of course has undergone a huge change over the years. The expectations of the CEO and the top management, has undergone a change. IT has replaced most of the routine jobs.
The ‘Personnel’ function has undergone significant changes in the last couple of decades. There is a clear shift from Industrial Relations to Organisational Development. Today HR is looked at as a Business Partner and it is expected to contribute to the business growth firstly, by getting talent on board, which delivers, then nurturing and developing home grown talent and at times weeding out non-performers or those that do not fit in. HR today, has to work closely with the business partners at all levels—have an ear to the ground and at the same time keep running.
LinkedIn and other such sites have helped us in recruitment process. The recruitment process per say has undergone a change. Today we are conducting these psychometric tests and depending on it. Earlier psychometric tests were not given any importance—you find a right person and hire him/her. All these things have helped in changing the whole process and even the consultants have changed. They are also using these latest tools.
Succession Planning is critical for sustainability. I am of the firm believer of the fact that however good you are, you are replaceable. This is not to say that people are not important in an organisation. Every member in an organisation is important but the organisation must ensure that there is a proper succession plan in place so that the ripples when a key person exits are not felt and business in any way is not adversely affected. At Kan sai Nerolac, all the key positions have been identified and immediate and long-term successors are part of the Talent Pool. The respective HODs and HR have periodic dialogues with the talent pool members and individual development plans are drawn up after discussions with them.
I was with Siemens for 26 years and as you would expect in a German company—it was organised, very systematic, system driven processes, SAP implemented in all areas. At Kansai Nerolac, I was surprised to discover that we were probably at par with the latest of IT technology. The environment was more dynamic as our business is far more complex and hence decision making has to be quick. Nerolac was founded in 1920 and Siemens is there since 1922 in India. The culture and style of working is similar in both the companies and hence I had no difficulties whatsoever in acclimatisation. The only (visible) difference is – I wore a tie to office in Siemens every day and which I continue to do so till today – but no one else in the senior management at Nerolac does so.
"There is no substitute to hard work. Do not miss out an opportunity to take on more responsibility especially when there is problem at work. Every problem has two solutions: Run away or Participate. Choose the latter and you will always succeed "
Stop getting into the trap of doing voluminous transactional work. While this may give you a false sense of being busy and hardworking, in reality it may not be adding much value to the business. Many of the traditional tasks like Recruitment, Payroll and evening will be outsourced to experts. HR will have to focus on strategy and strategy implementation. It will have to ensure that the internal talent is continuously developed to meet the ever changing and volatile business scenario.
In today’s intense competitive business world, the stress at work has increased manifold in the last two decades. Timelines for delivery of high quality goods and services have shrunk and customer expectations have skyrocketed. In such a situation, HR too will feel the heat to deliver quickly on the expectations from the top management and the Board. HR will also be entrusted to create culture and environment which is conducive in which organisation members can give their best.
Youngsters nowadays is a different-cup-of-tea altogether. There is huge peer pressure and they themselves are not clear. Lot of youngsters I meet change jobs every two years, which I am very much against. There is a huge peer pressure on them, whether it be of the money aspect, great company office, better culture or whatever. My advice to youngsters is give any organisation at least two years. Then if the organisation doesn’t take care of you, you are free to go. What we do internally is, if a person is good and we take him as a management trainee, we let him know within two years that the company has a plan for him/her and they have the potential. So, identify the potential quickly, because they are not going to wait for more than two years.
Job satisfaction is definitely different for youngsters, which we will never know. While we are telling them you have a career path and we have sent you for training, they will say so what. Their aspiration is how can I become a regional manager in the next four years, but I know that normally it would take around 8–10 years.
In future, there will be no operational and transactional role for HR, it will be entirely focused on leadership development and making sure that you have the best talent on board which can deliver. The performance management system will continue to be a key area for all HR Professionals. While some noteworthy organisations have been declaring that they are relooking at the way appraisals are done and also doing away with management favourite ‘Bell Curve’, no real alternate to this system has emerged. In my view, forget about the bell curve or whatever mechanism or tool you wish to use. End of the day, you need to differentiate performance between the employees and ultimately decide what you can afford to pay, keeping in mind the industry standard. Do not complicate issues of appraisals by hyping one method over another, keep it simple and most importantly, transparent.
The area of training and employee engagement too will see Gamification as a game changer. Today, Gamification is widely recognised as an engaging tool for all HR initiatives. Another area which will see disruption in HR is Digitalisation – HR services and deliverables will undergo a dramatic shift through the use of technology enabled digital platforms, mobile applications and deliver higher efficiency and be far more effective through deployment of integrated digital solutions. Predictive Analysis is an emerging trend for data-driven decision making and will make the HR function far more agile.
All HR leaders must remember that organisation members respect you for one of the two reasons – Either because you have power or because your behaviour is helpful. The first one is temporary but the second one is permanent. We must learn to respect people in all walks of life not just the professional arena.
This is natural fallout of respect for every individual. There are different ways of looking at Trust. I firmly believe that if you trust people, they will give you their best. While there have been rare aberrations where I felt let down, I have not permitted such exceptions to change my belief in trusting people.
Learn to work across all types and levels of people at the earliest. You will start working alone in the beginning, but as you grow within your network, then your interpersonal skills are tested. Every HR professional should ideally have spent quality time either in the Plant or been a business partner to Sales. This is important grounding for taking on higher responsibilities.
There is no substitute to hard work. Do not miss out an opportunity to take on more responsibility especially when there is problem at work. Every problem has two solutions: Run away or Participate. Choose the latter and you will always succeed.
Every HR professional must have a positive outlook to everything even in the times of severe adversity. You may at times get away with lack of knowledge, but no expert can succeed without a positive attitude. Appreciate what you have.
The biggest concern for any organisation is when their most passionate people become quiet. An HR professional must be passionate. When I recruit anyone in HR, I look for the 4 Ps – Performance, Potential, Passion and Patience. Every HR person is looked at by the rest of the organisation as a management representative. Hence, your body language is an indicator of what’s happening–exude confidence at all times. An important thing to bear in mind is never talk negatively about anyone–no gossip, no talking or criticising behind anyone’s back, else people will stop trusting you.
While practically every business leader will rightly talk about being Customer centric, the HR professional must pause and ask oneself, if everyone is taking care of the customer then who is taking care of my employees. Consider employees as your ‘internal’ customers and work for their wellbeing.
Have anchors outside work area, they are extremely important. You must pursue a hobby, a sport or anything you love to do which is not directly connected with work. This brings stability to your life. My sincere request to all youngsters is please take care of your health. As long as you are fit you will have a job. Otherwise, you have HR people to tell you that it is not working out. Remember, you are important to the organisation and organisation too will take care of you as long it exists and as long as you are able to continue to perform better year on year. It is important to remember that no one is indispensable.
While it may not come naturally to all, but do try and cultivate a sense of humour, it will get you out of difficult situations. It will help you in your professional life as well as your personal life.
By Rajesh Rao
